Bugs with the orcs.

Grunhilda

Private
Hey, I can't get the bug form to download on my device so this is probably formatted all wrong but...

The orc shaman has some spell problems. With the invis spell it prevents a player from targeting the shaman at all, but the computer ai can still hit them in melee. I don't if everyone should be able to melee an invis shaman or no one, but some and not others seems wrong. Also the club spell says it gives 2 strength which is basically nothing in your system. It should probably be 20?

Animosity is also inconsistent about being in melee. Being the victim of an animosity charge prevents you from shooting as if you were in melee, but it doesn't prevent you from being shot as if you weren't. It should be in melee or not in melee.

Orcs are missing access to several pieces of equipment available to all other warbands. For example the rope and hook, the garlic, and the dwarven Christmas hats. I don't know if that is an exhaustive list, but maybe if you go in to check that you can see the whole list behind the scenes.

Thanks!
 

Prabdeep Bazaz

Social Media Manager
Staff member
Thanks for reporting.

We've tried to replicate the first issue listed but had no luck with what you're seeing. Would you be able to give us step-by-step instructions on what you did?
 

Grunhilda

Private
Sure, it's multiple cases so...

When I play against an AI controlled orc group with a shaman. If their shaman is adjacent to one of my troops and turns invis, I cannot click/tap on him to target him, therefore I cannot attack him, even though he is in melee range, and should be attackable.

When I am playing as the orcs, the opposing AI team seems to know where my shaman is, even though he is invis. He can get attacked in several circumstances. For example.

If he is alone the AI will run to a space directly adjacent to my shaman, and can then freely attack him on the next turn even if he stays invis by recasting the spell.

If the shaman is adjacent to another orc that is not invis, the AI player can charge the other model, and then freely attack my invis shaman. Worst personal example was standing next to a stunned orc, who got one shot by the charge on a dwarf pistollier, who then unloaded all his shots and extra attacks into the face of my orc shaman who was invis and previously unengaged. He died in one round, when a player wouldn't have been able to hit him at all.

This also works if the shaman moves next to an unengaged enemy model, and then casts invis. The AI controlled enemy can still hit back at the shaman.


As an aside, as a personal opinion, I think moving adjacent to the shaman should simply break the invis, like revealing a hidden model. That seems to be how the AI is treating it already, but breaking the invis from that range would make it work the same for players, and make it more clear that the shaman is no longer concealed.

I hope that helps.

unless you meant the strength thing on the club spell? I haven't tested that yet. I don't know if it really gives 20 strength and the 2 in the description is just a typo?
 

Bringabong

Private
Hey, I can't get the bug form to download on my device so this is probably formatted all wrong but...

The orc shaman has some spell problems. With the invis spell it prevents a player from targeting the shaman at all, but the computer ai can still hit them in melee. I don't if everyone should be able to melee an invis shaman or no one, but some and not others seems wrong. Also the club spell says it gives 2 strength which is basically nothing in your system. It should probably be 20?

Animosity is also inconsistent about being in melee. Being the victim of an animosity charge prevents you from shooting as if you were in melee, but it doesn't prevent you from being shot as if you weren't. It should be in melee or not in melee.

Orcs are missing access to several pieces of equipment available to all other warbands. For example the rope and hook, the garlic, and the dwarven Christmas hats. I don't know if that is an exhaustive list, but maybe if you go in to check that you can see the whole list behind the scenes.

Thanks!
I agree, Orcs are missing access to several pieces of equipment available to all other warbands. For example the rope and hook, yes rope n hook should be available, their is no good reason why rope n hook couldn't be acquired and used by Orcs. Orcs are lacking expensive items. I understand that there is a cap on orc armor ratings. But could serval pieces of armor be made with bonuses to other stats as well as armour rating. Similar to the full plate that gives bonus to leadership. Suggestion armor that gives bonus to parry, or bonus against missiles and make it very expensive. After purchasing orc shaman staff at 430 gold, there is nothing expensive left to purchase.
Orcs hate Dwarves so not using there caps is understandable. Orcs never grew garlic to ward off vampires so also understandable and orc should have a easier time against undead than other warbands.
More hired swords for orcs, Troll or cave squig maybe even wolf riders.
Orcs need customisation options, currently none
 
Last edited:

Prabdeep Bazaz

Social Media Manager
Staff member
Sure, it's multiple cases so...

When I play against an AI controlled orc group with a shaman. If their shaman is adjacent to one of my troops and turns invis, I cannot click/tap on him to target him, therefore I cannot attack him, even though he is in melee range, and should be attackable.

When I am playing as the orcs, the opposing AI team seems to know where my shaman is, even though he is invis. He can get attacked in several circumstances. For example.

If he is alone the AI will run to a space directly adjacent to my shaman, and can then freely attack him on the next turn even if he stays invis by recasting the spell.

If the shaman is adjacent to another orc that is not invis, the AI player can charge the other model, and then freely attack my invis shaman. Worst personal example was standing next to a stunned orc, who got one shot by the charge on a dwarf pistollier, who then unloaded all his shots and extra attacks into the face of my orc shaman who was invis and previously unengaged. He died in one round, when a player wouldn't have been able to hit him at all.

This also works if the shaman moves next to an unengaged enemy model, and then casts invis. The AI controlled enemy can still hit back at the shaman.


As an aside, as a personal opinion, I think moving adjacent to the shaman should simply break the invis, like revealing a hidden model. That seems to be how the AI is treating it already, but breaking the invis from that range would make it work the same for players, and make it more clear that the shaman is no longer concealed.

I hope that helps.

unless you meant the strength thing on the club spell? I haven't tested that yet. I don't know if it really gives 20 strength and the 2 in the description is just a typo?
Thanks for the info, we've updated the Ai and fixed the clubba description to match its effect.

Just on the Animosity bug, the team have also not been successful in replicating the issue. Would you be able to give us extra info on the bug?
 

Grunhilda

Private
Well, okay. What I'm complaining about is pretty straight forward. I have one orc archer in my warband, lets call him Shooty Boy. For purposes of this example we'll need a second orc. Lets call him Choppa Boy. And a Cowardly Humie, lets call him Sir Pansy.

If Choppa Boy is standing next to Shooty Boy, and Choppa Boy fails his animosity test he'll charge Shooty Boy and make one attack. Then on Shooty Boy'z next turn, no matter how much Sir Pansy Reikhumie is asking for it, Shooty Boy cannot shoot him, because Shooty Boy is "in combat" with Choppa Boy. However, if Sir Pansy's turn comes around before Shooty Boy, or if Shooty Boy decides to sulk on his turn, then Sir Pansy can shoot at Shooty Boy until he's blue in the face. Because as far as Sir Pansy is concerned, Shooty Boy is not "in combat." What I'm suggesting is that Shooty Boy should be considered either universally "in combat" or universally not "in combat." As either solution would be more intuitive than how it currently works, if we are operating under the idea that "if you can shoot me, then I can shoot back."

You have one other problem with your current Animosity rules, I wasn't going to report it because I think it's hilariously good fun, but since you asked about Animosity specifically...

If Choppa Boy fails his animosity test after Shooty Boy has been cowardly shot to death by Sir Pansy, then he will still charge Shooty Boy and kick his dead corpse in the face. In game terms this doesn't really do anything other than make Shooty Boy repeat his death animation, so I'm not sure it's a bug. But it seemed odd...and hilarious.

Also not necessarily bugs, since your game isn't really tabletop, but there are a few places where you changed how animosity works from tabletop, that make it function more like Stupidity, which is a little sad to me. Specifically:

1. In tabletop you didn't have to test for animosity if you were already in combat, in Warband Skirmish you do.
2. In tabletop it was possible for animosity to cause a shooter to shoot an ally if no one was in charge range, in Warband Skirmish it isn't.
3. In tabletop if the nearest orc was a Black Orc a failed animosity test didn't result in a charge, it would get downgraded to a sulk because Black Orcs are too scary to charge, allowing you to overcome hurting your own units by carefully planned strategic placement of troops. In Warband Skirmish even a cowardly gobo will charge a Black Orc if it's the closest model.

Also, not a bug, but a strong suggestion: The lack of any armor penetration on any orc weapons is a major weakness of the warband. Possible solutions are to add "Smasha" weapons, clubs basically, something on par to what ogres use perhaps? I would even go so far as to say that the graphics on the ogre weapons are probably fine for orcs if you just port them straight over. In tabletop there were two weapons on the lists that you haven't included, goblins got clubs, and orcs got morning stars. Either of which could fill the blunt weapon armor penetration niche in your game. Alternatively, as Bringabong points out, there are very few expensive items in the orc list to reach or save up for. You could add "Black Orc" versions of the existing weapons that had a higher gold cost and -5 or -10 to your opponents armor as an extra stat. Like Gromril for the other bands but not quite as good. Maybe +5 crit and -10 armor, at the same cost modifier of Gromril? That would preserve the crit theme of the warband and still give some armor penetration. And you wouldn't really needed different graphics, maybe just a darker color palette to make them "Black." You could even make them require the Black Orc skill to equip potentially, since the skill is already there. Also wouldn't mind some "Black Orc" armour with +leadership.
 
Last edited:

Grunhilda

Private
Another orc bug: the "Orc Shield" and the "Orc Full Shield" have exactly the same stats but the full shield costs more for no reason. I feel the full shield should have some kind of bonus or difference. Maybe +11 defense and no Parry like the emblem shields for the humies. Or give it a little leadership bonus.
 

Bringabong

Private
Another orc bug: the "Orc Shield" and the "Orc Full Shield" have exactly the same stats but the full shield costs more for no reason. I feel the full shield should have some kind of bonus or difference. Maybe +11 defense and no Parry like the emblem shields for the humies. Or give it a little leadership bonus.
The orc full shield with a bonus against missiles. Pls.
 
Top