Bunch of "how does it works?" Questions: turf and combat

Spiritus

Private
Greetings,
Can someone explain what does the wound stat does? Since it does look like in battle you have 5-7 wounds, not the 20-40 your stats says.
How does the tech trade works? Does each ganger put there has a chance of finding rare gear to buy, or does only the total int of All ganger present counts. What does upgrading the trade with new territory does? Increase level of gear, increase chances, increase number of items?
I'm fed up being stuck with superior/Mastercraft version of the standard gear, when my openings are rocking plasma, meltas and power weapons...
 

Ewan Lamont

Administrator
Staff member
There is a complex algorithm involved but in simple terms Wounds and Strength get decimalized in the game. You can function ok until you lose all your wounds and are out of action at a loss of 150% wounds.
 
Greetings,
Can someone explain what does the wound stat does? Since it does look like in battle you have 5-7 wounds, not the 20-40 your stats says.
How does the tech trade works? Does each ganger put there has a chance of finding rare gear to buy, or does only the total int of All ganger present counts. What does upgrading the trade with new territory does? Increase level of gear, increase chances, increase number of items?
I'm fed up being stuck with superior/Mastercraft version of the standard gear, when my openings are rocking plasma, meltas and power weapons...
I stopped buying anything more than standard lasguns & laspistols for my gangers, when the AI opposition would turn up with one-shot-one-kill bolters or 5 or 6 heavily armed gangers against my 4 person patrol.

My tech bazaar is still only level 1 & the combined intelligence is 255. Screenshot attached. I've seen standard quality, superior & master crafted las weapons & rad weapons. Never afforded any of those. There's been some standard & reclaimed quality bolters, flamers, heavy stubbers & needle rifles. Never seen meltas or plasma for trading, though the AI has started equipping the enemy with plasmas. Sometimes it's even 5 or 6 person gangs totting plasma guns or bolters - which I do understand is to present a challenge.

Quick question for @Ewan Lamont - when the AI picks a gang, does it match/exceed the power level via numbers & weapons, or does it as additional skills, as some opposition are highly equipped & very skilled?

& actually a second question - who comes up with the AI gang names, as some of them are pretty amusing? ;)
 

Ewan Lamont

Administrator
Staff member
The AI are other players gang squads pulled from the database. Every ganger's upkeep value is based on how dangerous they are in the game. We try and make each battle a good interesting match based on the points value. The thing to really watch out for is if any weapons or skills are recurring in gangs that beat you where you stood no chance they may need rebalancing.
 
The AI are other players gang squads pulled from the database. Every ganger's upkeep value is based on how dangerous they are in the game. We try and make each battle a good interesting match based on the points value. The thing to really watch out for is if any weapons or skills are recurring in gangs that beat you where you stood no chance they may need rebalancing.
Thanks for the insight @Ewan Lamont . I'm going to have to have a word with my Van Saars, if they've been playing away without me ;)

So what sort of power level variation will it be, such as plus or minus 10 or 20%, a I've faced some rediculous weapon sets, typically bolters, or gang sizes?

SOB
 
Thanks for the insight @Ewan Lamont . I'm going to have to have a word with my Van Saars, if they've been playing away without me ;)

So what sort of power level variation will it be, such as plus or minus 10 or 20%, a I've faced some rediculous weapon sets, typically bolters, or gang sizes?

SOB
With this new knowledge I considered the match my Van Saars have just had. 4 person gang, a few skills, a master crafted laspistol, std shockstave, laspistol, shockbaton, 2 std lasguns. Played against 5 member Goliath's, with double handed weapon, bolter or their hand cannon (whatever kicks up a dust cloud like the bolter does & a hand flamer. Never got to see what no.5 was carrying.

So the bolter/canon took out 1 Van Saar in 2 shots (my ganger was behind cover, up a level, but the Goliath didn't miss with either shot) & when they inevetiably closed in, my gang couldn't even land a melee attack to slow them down. The hand flamer causing damage & taking both action points to extinguish sealed my fate. In my opinion, not a fair match
 
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The AI are other players gang squads pulled from the database. Every ganger's upkeep value is based on how dangerous they are in the game. We try and make each battle a good interesting match based on the points value. The thing to really watch out for is if any weapons or skills are recurring in gangs that beat you where you stood no chance they may need rebalancing.
Just ran a cycle, where drinking den crew had an AI battle, which was very questionable.

3 man Van Saars, not particularly skilled & packing weapons which I removed from battle gangs, to try to decrease their power levels. 1 reclaimed las carbine + laspistol, 1 superior las carbine + laspistol, 1 superior las subcarbine + shockbaton. A grapnellauncher.

I was pitted against a 4 man Van Saar gang, with 2 las carbines, combat shotgun & radcannon.

Appreciating a couple of superior quality on my side, but 3 against 4 with 2 weapons matching & then 2 higher powered options, including a heavy weapon.

2 gangers out of action, 1 with an injury & the final one fled, thankfully.

Power rating of the gang is 279.

SOBScreenshot_20210920-001901.png
 
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Chronos

Major
Don't equip your gangers with pistols, having two weapons greatly increases the squad value while not being that useful. Having las carbines on your shooters should be enough (just don't let the enemy get close enough). For your close combat guy you could keep the pistol, but for my Van Saars he just has the shockbaton and he just completes objectives or protects the shooters.

That way you will get you easier matches as pistols alone will probably make for those differences you are getting.
 
Don't equip your gangers with pistols, having two weapons greatly increases the squad value while not being that useful. Having las carbines on your shooters should be enough (just don't let the enemy get close enough). For your close combat guy you could keep the pistol, but for my Van Saars he just has the shockbaton and he just completes objectives or protects the shooters.

That way you will get you easier matches as pistols alone will probably make for those differences you are getting.
Thanks. Since restructuring my gang, removing carbines for standard lasguns & swapping pistol backups for knuckledusters & improvised shivs, I had a mountain of good weapons, which the cheapest ones ended up on my bazaar/den/slag gangers & the pistols were backup for the guns without plentiful trait.

I was expecting a tough fight, but not to go up against the local intake for the Militarum Tempestus Scions ;)

SOB
 

Chronos

Major

Screenshot_20210920-085653.jpgScreenshot_20210920-085643.jpg
These are my Van Saar main squads (225 and 237 power respectively). So, 50 power less than your squad and can tear any rival gang into pieces.

I've just kept power low while investing in what I really needed, high initiative command leader (with no weapons), high bs, every shooting skill and superior las carbine for my shooter and high mobility and close combat weapon for my support guy.

That should be more than enough for almost every mission.
 

View attachment 2113View attachment 2114
These are my Van Saar main squads (225 and 237 power respectively). So, 50 power less than your squad and can tear any rival gang into pieces.

I've just kept power low while investing in what I really needed, high initiative command leader (with no weapons), high bs, every shooting skill and superior las carbine for my shooter and high mobility and close combat weapon for my support guy.

That should be more than enough for almost every mission.
Intriguing.

I've not taken it, but when I looked at the skill to unlock additional squad members, I thought a 5 or 6 person gang would see power levels go through the roof. @Chronos do you usually end up facing 3/4/5/6 person squads?

When I realised high power levels were the antithesis of fun games, a tried going over to all just pistols, to cover shooting & melee in one weapon, but found Escher gangs were on top of me & poisoning too quickly & Goliath's just weathered the flashlights & tore me apart.

Time to try a change again.

SOB
 
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Chronos

Major
I've not taken it, but when I looked at the skill to unlock additional squad members, I thought a 5 or 6 person gang would see power levels go through the roof. @Chronos do you usually end up facing 3/4/5/6 person squads?
It depends, usually no less than 4, sometimes 5, seldom 6. The more enemies I'm facing the less equipment they have, so unless deployment is very bad enemies numbers are not an issue. You usually have one turn in advance so you can position yourself, I just keep my leader hidden in a place where he can order any of the other two gangers. My shooter is placed where he can cover most of the terrain and opposite to where I think enemies will be deployed and depending on the mission my support guy advances towards those objectives or I keep him near my shooter so he can defend him if any enemies come close enough.
In the second turn I wait for the enemy to move so I can see where they are and move so I can get better line of sight or if already in sight I shoot them. Having a high BS ganger (with two shots and both the skills to reduce defense and ignore cover) means that with order I can shoot four times a turn (except for when I have to reload that I only get three shots) and that I almost always hit the target. With those four shots I try to first kill those long ranged gangers so they cannot pin my shooter and pin the close combat ones so they struggle to get into close combat. If anyone gets too close (as I said that is quite unlikely and only happens when I have some very bad deployment zones) the support guy engages any threats or gives the final blow to already beaten up gangers.
With that kind of strategy I usually have just one OOA every maybe 10-20 fights, so I will say it is quite successful.
 
It depends, usually no less than 4, sometimes 5, seldom 6. The more enemies I'm facing the less equipment they have, so unless deployment is very bad enemies numbers are not an issue. You usually have one turn in advance so you can position yourself, I just keep my leader hidden in a place where he can order any of the other two gangers. My shooter is placed where he can cover most of the terrain and opposite to where I think enemies will be deployed and depending on the mission my support guy advances towards those objectives or I keep him near my shooter so he can defend him if any enemies come close enough.
In the second turn I wait for the enemy to move so I can see where they are and move so I can get better line of sight or if already in sight I shoot them. Having a high BS ganger (with two shots and both the skills to reduce defense and ignore cover) means that with order I can shoot four times a turn (except for when I have to reload that I only get three shots) and that I almost always hit the target. With those four shots I try to first kill those long ranged gangers so they cannot pin my shooter and pin the close combat ones so they struggle to get into close combat. If anyone gets too close (as I said that is quite unlikely and only happens when I have some very bad deployment zones) the support guy engages any threats or gives the final blow to already beaten up gangers.
With that kind of strategy I usually have just one OOA every maybe 10-20 fights, so I will say it is quite successful.
Thanks for the insight.

Quick question about order, what's the difference between buying it once or twice, as I'm unable to see the difference, with my sleep addled brain? Within 12 & two actions for both I believe

SOB
 

Chronos

Major
Thanks for the insight.

Quick question about order, what's the difference between buying it once or twice, as I'm unable to see the difference, with my sleep addled brain? Within 12 & two actions for both I believe

SOB
First order I think it reaches 6 and second 12. Always get order 2 if possible as it really makes a difference when you want to reposition your shooter without losing the extra action by having to also reposition the leader.
 
First order I think it reaches 6 and second 12. Always get order 2 if possible as it really makes a difference when you want to reposition your shooter without losing the extra action by having to also reposition the leader.
Thanks again. I have my leader with order 2 & a champion with order 1. Description appears the same. I've checked someone without any order skill & seen the different description there :)

SOBScreenshot_20210920-085911.png

Screenshot_20210920-085841.png
 

Chronos

Major
I'm assuming the thing there is you get the description of what you get if you spend the 25XP (that is order 2) or what you already have if you cannot update the skill any further. That's the reason why for both your leader and champion you get the same description, but for someone without any order skill you are shown the order 1 (the one they can get).

And yes, it is quite confusing... Maybe if it is a updatable skill you should get info about current one and the one you are getting if you update it, not just the one that you will get.
 
I'm assuming the thing there is you get the description of what you get if you spend the 25XP (that is order 2) or what you already have if you cannot update the skill any further. That's the reason why for both your leader and champion you get the same description, but for someone without any order skill you are shown the order 1 (the one they can get).

And yes, it is quite confusing... Maybe if it is a updatable skill you should get info about current one and the one you are getting if you update it, not just the one that you will get.
The description text on this does show the next level of the skill as opposed to the current level, unless you're at the maximum.

Thanks for the information & advice.

And nice customisation on the gangers.

SOB
 

Ewan Lamont

Administrator
Staff member
Thanks for the insight @Ewan Lamont . I'm going to have to have a word with my Van Saars, if they've been playing away without me ;)

So what sort of power level variation will it be, such as plus or minus 10 or 20%, a I've faced some rediculous weapon sets, typically bolters, or gang sizes?

SOB
Every battle now should tell the power value of you vs your opponent at the top next to the rout ball. If the values are close and you felt one side did not stand a chance we'd like to know.
 

Spiritus

Private
Every battle now should tell the power value of you vs your opponent at the top next to the rout ball. If the values are close and you felt one side did not stand a chance we'd like to know.
I ain't seeing anything next to the rout ball!

I have seen some weird things that need clarification though?
Does quality of weapons affect hit chances? Because a lot of melee weapons don't show any visible differences between quality level.
Also how does reload work? I thought I knew but some weapons don't make sense: plentiful and scarce weapons have a reload value. And plasma don't have scarce but have reload 0?
 
Every battle now should tell the power value of you vs your opponent at the top next to the rout ball. If the values are close and you felt one side did not stand a chance we'd like to know.
Playing a match with my Crawdors
(the Hawdors) & bumped into one of my Orlock crews (the BOrlocks). Small world/hive :D Kicked their arses thankfully, though I think they were a hab crew, rather than a patrol. I was even unkind enough to use a heavy crossbow on them, which is the first time I've used it. Kudos for making it able to fire with you in the blast radius :p



SOB


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