Explanation of combat mechanic please

Discussion in 'Open Discussion' started by Speigas, Dec 10, 2016.

  1. Speigas Private

    Message Count:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Can we get explanation of combat mechanic? How strength affects damage? How defense value works?

    I would be beneficial to understand such background, so we can test it, find abnormalities and suggest something.

    Thanks,
    Yosefthegod and morjax like this.
  2. Speigas Private

    Message Count:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    3
    What kind of bonus weapon class focus skill provides?
  3. morjax YouTuber & Moderator

    Message Count:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    46

    I'm not 100% certain, but I'm pretty sure this is how each works:

    • Weapon Skill: Determines your chance to hit, as well as opens up various weapon and attack-based skills
    • Strength: Determines how hard you hit (hence 2-handed weapons that have the +10 or +15 to strength). This also allows you to take some two-handed and toughness-based skills
    • Defense: I'm less sure on this, but I believe that the enemy's defense is subtracted from your strength to determine how hard the hit is. If you have 40 strength and the enemy has 20 armor, there's a chance their armor will deflect some of that hit. Some weapons cap enemy armor (most notably hammers/maces with the "Max enemy defence +XX" text)
    • Parry is a separate roll from the others. If the attack er lands the hit, there's an X chance to negate the attack, where X is your parry roll.
    Devs: Please correct me where I'm off base (especially for defense! How does that work?).
  4. Overwatch Community Manager

    Message Count:
    888
    Trophy Points:
    66
    Here's a more detailed explanation of how the combat mechanic works, and a bit of info on the stats:

    Chance to hit (Melee):
    50+ (Attackers Weapons Skill – Defenders Weapon Skill) = percentage value

    Calculations for working out how defence affects your chance to hit:
    100 – Whatever your opponents defence is, multiply this figure by 0.01, then multiply by whatever your hit chance is.

    An example of these calculations:
    If for example my unit had a weapon skill of 32 and my opponent had a weapon skill of 40, the percentage value would be 42%.
    50+ (32-40) = 42%

    Let’s then say my opponent has a defence of 13. In order to work out defence as a percentage:
    100 – 13 = 87%

    The adjusted chance to hit would then be:
    42* (87*0.01) = 36.54%


    Chance to hit (Ranged):
    50+(Attackers ballistic skill - modifiers)

    Ranged Modifiers:
    Weapon Accuracy
    Cover Bonus
    Target Moved / Target Ran
    Shooter Moved


    Information about stats:
    Strength: Is used to calculate how much damage you can potentially inflict (Strength/10)

    Defence: Reduces the chance of being hit

    Critical chance: The percentage chance of doubling damage

    Parry: The chance of negating up to 2 hits
  5. morjax YouTuber & Moderator

    Message Count:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    46
    @OverWatch: Why can't I give you more likes for this post?? XD Super helpful!
    JesterArke and OverWatch like this.
  6. Overwatch Community Manager

    Message Count:
    888
    Trophy Points:
    66
    Glad you find it useful!! Happy to help ;)
    morjax likes this.
  7. morjax YouTuber & Moderator

    Message Count:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    46

    Now my gears are turning about max melee resistance...

    Max Armor: sword with Votive shield gives +15 def, Gromril armor +40 def, mask helm +9 def: 10% parry, 64 Armor

    With Parry: sword and buckler gives a 20% chance to parry, Gromril armor and Mask helm give Defence +40 and 9, respectively: 20% parry, 49 armor

    In-betweener: Sword and comet shield gives +15% parry, +9 def, gromril and mask give +49: 15% parry, 58 Armor.

    Now to think about which one gives the most benefit (armor vs parry). #GearsTurning

    edit: of course, there's also to consider that hammers/maces can limit def, but I do't think there's any way to negate enemy parry...
  8. Overwatch Community Manager

    Message Count:
    888
    Trophy Points:
    66
    Watch out every one!

    If you see a Warband full of juggernauts now you know who it is...

    Interesting stuff though, the possibilities!! :cool:
  9. Adam Smith Lead Programmer

    Message Count:
    103
    Trophy Points:
    46

    Just to point out, with the first build, if you were up against someone with the exact same weapon skill they would get an 18% hit chance against you... Definitely time for hammers!
    morjax likes this.
  10. Speigas Private

    Message Count:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Strength: Is used to calculate how much damage you can potentially inflict (Strength/10)

    If above is correct... then max non critical damage of bows should be 3. Which is not true. I saw multiple times when longbow is able to score 4+ non critical damage.

    Also +5 strength on certain weapons are useful only if they allow trooper to reach/exceed 10 strength interval (20-30-40 and so on). So its useless for trooper with strength value of say 30-34, which is sad...
  11. Miette de Corbin Corporal

    Message Count:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Second Speigas' observation - if damage is Strength/10, does it round up?
  12. Adam Smith Lead Programmer

    Message Count:
    103
    Trophy Points:
    46
    It neither rounds down or rounds up...

    What it does is treats the strength / 10 as a whole number (retaining the decimal part however)

    So Strength 32 gives you damage of 3.

    But! The decimal part is turned into a percentage chance of increasing the damage by one.
    E.g. 32 / 10 = 3.2
    0.2 * 100 = 20
    20% chance of increasing damage by one.

    This way the small increases in Strength do still count for something, steadily improving your chance of scoring more damage the closer you get to a whole number.

    So following Speigas' example of +5 strength on certain weapons, that would give the example above with a 70% chance of rolling 4 hits instead of 3.

    Hope this helps!
  13. Adam Smith Lead Programmer

    Message Count:
    103
    Trophy Points:
    46
    On the point of Long Bows causing 4+ non critical damage, that as far as I'm aware isn't possible. Did these hits cause an out if action result? Because we don't display whether the hit was a critical (which in that case it must have been to get higher than the base 3)
    morjax likes this.
  14. Miette de Corbin Corporal

    Message Count:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Understood- thanks Adam. I like that mechanic
    morjax likes this.
  15. Speigas Private

    Message Count:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Yep that might be it. All those longbow 4+ non crits usually were final hits. So it explains this occurrence.

    As of +5 str, its good to know that everything helps.
  16. Lorka Corporal

    Message Count:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    16
    This is fine, compared to Mordheim where you have weapon skills between 1-10 and you rolled a d6 to hit. If you had higher than opponent you hit on 3+, else you hit on 4+ unless you opponent had more than twice your WS then you hit on 5+.

    Now this seems to be quite a nerf of what in Mordheim used to be quite bad armour to begin with. In Mordheim armour give you a save to not get wounded at all. Why did you want armour to modify to hit instead of to wound? Would make more sense to me that it reduced strength somehow.

    This seems to make BS much better than it is in Mordheim. In Mordheim you hit on a 4+ with a BS of 3, 3+ with BS 4 etc and 5+ with BS 2 etc. This got modified with -1 for shooter moving, -1 for cover, -1 for long range. This also means the standard BS 3 Marksman cannot hit a target in cover in long range while moving, since you needed to roll a 7+ on a d6.

    Now I assume this is balanced with all the modifiers you have added.

    Can you parry missile damage? Is this why I sometimes see hits for zero damage?
    Yosefthegod likes this.
  17. morjax YouTuber & Moderator

    Message Count:
    276
    Trophy Points:
    46

    We always played that as a 6 is a guaranteed hit, and a 1 is a guaranteed miss, so there's always a chance at hitting so long as you're successfully in range. The enemy would get a free cover save, iirc? This of course led to more attacks being always the best way (more units with daggers vs less units with more gear; skaven with the broken, broken double shot slings; etc.).
  18. Lorka Corporal

    Message Count:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Mordheim by RAW and most way people play 1 is always a failure.
    A common house rule you could use the rule from Necromunda where 7 = first roll 6 then roll 4+ and 8 is first a 6, then 5+ etc.
    The problem is Mordheim was balanced around sometimes its a miss, or else you would be facing 20 Skavens using slings at short range that is 40 sling shot, if a 6 is always a hit, you will be rolling for rout next turn :)
    Tykkefar likes this.
  19. Sierra19 Corporal

    Message Count:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    16
  20. etherkye Major

    Message Count:
    302
    Trophy Points:
    31
    I'd really like for this information to be on the app somewhere, I think it's really useful to know.

Share This Page