Rating management

Discussion in 'Open Discussion' started by Cyberaddict, Jun 3, 2020.

  1. Cyberaddict Major

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    What’s the difference between dismissing a unit, and letting it die without reviving? Couldn’t you just dismiss with the same effect?

    Yes, indeed, if you’re the pilot of that Crimson Shade Addict Mage-Captain, we did faced each other yesterday. I recall I won the first two games, but I made a big mistake on the third. I had to disengage from melee with one Skaven, to enable ranged attacks. I made the mistake of healing it for 8 before I moved away, hoping it would survive your Lightning Reflexes free attack. But then you hit for 12, stunning my dude (at 11 W, regretting not taking that 3rd level in Wounds), which completely screwed the rest of my team. I should just have moved without healing. You would have put that Skaven Out Of Action, but I could then have gang up on you with all others. You flew away above a building, out of reach, and my way of conceding was to turn my units away, and walk in shame in the opposite direction. I hope you noticed, it was real role play there.

    So, I had to change the name of my Warband because of you! :) Honest, it was my first defeat in PvP with that Warband. Congratulations! « Literally Undefeated », was renamed Literally Salty, then Literally Frustrated, and finally I went on this morning as « The Predators ». It all went well, and again I had a new winning streak of 15+ matches, until I faced your Warband « Imagine no Possession ». :(

    I don’t know that map well, and I had trouble positioning my team. When finally I spotted your Beastman, your Mage-Captain took 2-3 drugs and just rushed me out of nowhere (strangely only triggering 2 Ambush instead of 7), stunning 2 units, IIRC. The rest is a blur. My daughter was upset with something, which distracted me a lot. I recalled I tried using Warpfire on your Troll, hoping it would put Out Of Action my stunned dude. This, to enable ranged attacks on all other units. Spell worked, but did not deal enough damage. I just hit the run icon then, to take care of whatever was upsetting my daughter that much (family first).

    Man, you’re a tough opponent! :) My only two defeats with my Skaven were against you. Now, the former Literally Undefeated, and temporary The Predators, have been renamed Shamed Rats... They will have to impress me again to deserve a more fearsome name.

    I do, however, have a question for you : how do you afford so much consumables? I think your Possessed team took a total of 4-5 drugs (Crimson Shade and Poison x 2 or x3, at least). You don’t win enough gold in a run to pay for that much consumables every game, right? Do you play vs AI to rebuild your stock? Me, I’m only playing PvP, and currently stocking up on gold for 7 pairs of Dual Warplock Pistols (shifting to that strategy is a long term project). In the mean time, I’ll invest my skill points in WS (defensively) and Unarmed Mastery + The Art of Silent Death (offensively for +5 Initiative and +15% Crits ; which brings my Crits with Shurikens to 65%). The extra melee attack will be useful when a crazy dude like you rush me in close combat. Instead of having to figure out how to enable ranged, I’ll just go Kung Fun in melee. :)
  2. Shangular Brigadier

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    Crimson shade is a must when you run solo. Yeah, that second match I actually had a good plan to attack but he failed a rout test, once of those chance events which makes GW games fun. That third match, that's typically my game plan for treasure hunts - get the chest and then force the enemy to fight on my terms. Kinda like the fourth match. Grab the chest then do hit and runs around a building. Actually with a solo cap, that's probably the most viable strategy against skaven.

    But for consumables, Possessed really have nothing else to spend gold on. Possessed warriors can't equip weapons or armor and Beastmen can't equip armor. So I just spend it all on consumables. I only also use consumables against opponents who know how to play, so not every match. These days it's hard to find active and good PVPers. Other than our matchups yesterday, the only active warband I've been able to find is one called Sons of Witches. He's good player too, runs a wizard captain with a few elves.
  3. Shangular Brigadier

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    Very different. When dismissing you lose that warrior permanently. If you let him die and don't revive, he stays in your warband as inactive (you'll see a ghost outline). You can then choose to pay 3 Fate to revive him later. But in the mean time, your rating is down and you won't waste all the time you spent levelling up that warrior. So it acts like an Active/Inactive Toggle.
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  4. Cyberaddict Major

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    LOL, I had forgotten how match #2 ended! IIRC, you were forced to make that Rout Test because of the Damage you took from Ambush, right? I was honestly surprised, but couldn’t help but smile at the humor of the situation when your drugged up Mage-Captain actually ran away after he charged in! :)

    Then, I must say I’m honestly flattered by the amount of consumables my 575 Warband forced your 1200ish Possessed to spend. :) I guess delaying my actions betrayed me... Do you suggest not delaying on turns 1 and 2, to avoid such situations?
  5. Shangular Brigadier

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    @Cyberaddict

    It was the sorcerer's warpfire that got him below the half marker. That second match was very Mordheim TT like where a rout test that you normally succeed in 9/10 times happens to be that one failure. In most TT rolls you want a high roll, except leadership tests (brings back members when I rolled a 12 on a leadership test in my TT gaming days). But I had it lined up perfectly, I had two of your skaven stunned, one which was your leader. Next turn I was just going to kill a different nearby Skaven to get you below the half marker and then fly behind that garden structure out of reach. Next turn your leader would automatically fail his rout test because he's stunned. Oh well, that's the fun of GW games. I love it!

    With Possessed you gotta hit first and hit hard. I think many people complain about the Possesed because they don't know how to use them right or build them right. The only couple losses I've taken with this Possessed warband have been in laughable failed rout situations like above. I really don't place much faith in ratings in determining a warbands, see my example above about the sniper rifle doubling a wizard captain's rating. I've played against warbands double my rating where it was too easy to win because of overrated skills being selected. From my skavens, I know which builds are underpriced and can be effective, again that's why I think Skaven are strongest at the beginning to mid levels although it starts to balance out at high levels when everyone is maxed (especially with the elves).

    I'd love to test the Skaven builds against 4 Elf warbands at low - mid levels. I never have because my Skaven and Middenheimers who have my elves are too high to do so. But you should seriously try to match up against that one warband I told you about: Sons of Witches who is around 900 rating. I faced him yesterday and he's pretty active in PVP que and is a good player. I'm very curious to see how a Skaven (either throwing star or warp pistol build) does against a wiz captain and 4 elves at that rating level.

    Also, I got plenty of consumables so don't worry lol! My possessed have like over 50 crimson shade saved up. My main warband, just checked this morning has like 294 saved up and that Reikland captain warband I sometimes use also has over 60 (remember old warbands used to be able to farm Palace Gardens and get tons of drops. Very easy to do with a wizard captain. Each single box there used to give you multiple items and gromil armor was a very common find. Legendary since then has fixed that, but it did allow old warbands to stock up tons of gold. Today people can easily farm The Pit for 10 - 13 shards or Magic Quarter for a good chance to get Tomes to sell.

    For your question of whether or not to delay, there is no direct answer as it is situational depending on both the scenario, opposing warband and the positional placement of both warbands.
  6. Cyberaddict Major

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    I think I already met and defeated that Warband, but not totally sure. There was one group of 4 elves, with red capes and wide-brimmed hats, with a Mage-Captain dressed in a red robe. IIRC, there were some other Marksmen in that team, all dressed in red wizard robes (identical twins of the Mage-Captain in both looks and weapons). I remember thinking that was a cheater, with 4 elves and 3 Warlocks. But that's just the look, because the weapons in their hand betrayed their true profession. It was a hard game, but I remember that I won it with the treasure within flight distance of the exit. :)

    BTW, I've developped a counter strategy against Flyers that want to get away with a Treasure : Dash recklessly, in the open (cover doesn't matter anymore, it's a race), in the direction of opponent's exit (I can survive ranged fire with Dodge, Elven Cloak, 14 Wounds and 40ish Defence). I'll only delay my actions for the first two rounds, and on the third round, I immediately charge in to remove their melee units (those that will hinder my team). Usually, I still have 8 units standing when I go for the win at the beginning of the 4th round.

    The Black Company (Reik 985, vs me at 615) just suffered from the success of that strategy. Gee, people probably think I'm a crazy noob when they first see a Skaven charge with Shurikens at point-blank range. But reality hit hard, and I usually can put a team within Rout Check in one sweep (even as Underdog).

    My Skavens are slowly healing their wounded honor. After some more victories, they're no longer the Shamed Rats, but the Redeemed Rats. A few more victories as Underdog, and they'll become Rats with a Reputation. If I can again defeat a solo Mage-Captain as the Underdog, then they'll deserve a true name. I would like to have one as provocative as The Undefeated and/or Literrally Undefeated (it helped a lot in the psychological warfare), but they can't hold that title anymore... because of you. :p

    Maybe they'll become the Chosen of the Horned Rat, but that is awfully formal, and doesn't suit their inflated ego at all. Suggestions are welcome! :)
  7. CzaRus Major

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    Name those sneaky basterds "Itchy Snitchy Genociders" or "Marsquarade of Surfin' Rat"
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  8. Cyberaddict Major

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    Just to give an extra edge to my Skaven Warband, I'm considering taking the Infiltration skill to everyone (but at the same time, so I'll save up skill points until they're all ready). I've never wanted to take that skill before, because there were more important skills to learn, and because it seemed to me a pretty bad strategy to have an extra turn on a single or just a few units (with low Leadership, the infiltrator is doomed to lose an All Alone Check eventually).

    Basically, I'm wondering how badly it would hurt my rating if I do learn this skill. I really want to keep my rating low enough to PvP on a regular basis (and I'm pretty sure that once I hit above 1000, PvP will mostly happen in the lobby, waiting for the next game).
  9. Cyberaddict Major

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    Was it you again @Shangular, with a red solo Mage-Captain with a two-handed axe, Warband named « Reikland Mercenaries », rating around 1180? And who needed Crimson Shade, Poison and Mad Cap Mushroom just to hope to defeat my Skavens? I hope it was, because they now deserve a name for your failed Leadership test! :)

    What was your tactic at the end? We were both skipping turns (5 and 6, IIRC). Me, I was going for the objectives with my 5 remaining units, to control the zones by turn 9. You flying away all the time, I felt it was that, or trigger Multiple Ambush...

    EDIT : Again? I think I faced another of your Solo Mage-Captain (rating 769) with my renamed Skavens "Doom of Shangular". If so, sorry, I killed your dude. My Assassin is fine, BTW, thanks to Blessing of Morr... ;)
  10. Shangular Brigadier

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    Gf on both lol. I experimented with the Ostland Axe just because it looks cool. I so want to play warbands based on how they look but mechanics and rating adjustments discourage it. You can see how it stupidly bumps up the rating exponentially. Foiled by that rout test. Yes, the tactic was to eventually pick off one my one with the hit and runs and eventually get force a rout test, which is one weakness for Skavs.

    No worries, I run with Morrs Blessing and Verana's Blessing all the time. Yes, I buy lots of Fate but I do so to support small companies like this that provide me an app with good entertainment.

    Reminds me of my Skavs at the level except I ran more of a warlock pistol/martial arts mix. These warbands are tough to beat at this rating level. But different at high level. If you want to try, we can do a private PVP match just so you can get a feel of how this Skaven format works at high level and help you develop it to that rating level if you choose to do so.
  11. Cyberaddict Major

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    Thanks for the invite. Thing is, I really LOVE to play PvP. The moment I start adding Dual Warplock Pistols and the necessary skills to use them well, my rating will skyrocket and I'll probably won't be able to play PvP much again with that Warband. I'm happy slowly building it up from where it is (average level is 31), while keeping the rating in check.

    Quite frankly, I thought the second time it must have been another Warband, identical but with lesser rating/levels than the first. Gee, the rating went down for 1180 to 790 just for changing the axe for something else? That's ridiculous.

    So... how do you like my new and permanent Warband's name : " Doom of Shangular " ? :)

    EDIT : BTW, have you noticed my new strategy against solo Mage-Captain? Keep at least 2 empty spaces between all units, to disable Combat Master and to prevent you from attacking 2 units at once. This forces you to remove one completely (concentrated attacks), which keeps all my other units free to attack with Shurikens on my turn! This, plus the added benefit of being very spread out, which means one or two can reach you where you've run away with Flight of Zimmerman. Pretty proud of my counter strategy. :)
  12. Shangular Brigadier

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    Yeah, I love PvP too. When I built up my Skaven, PVP it was on the old rating system and PVP was pretty active then. Even when the new rating system took place, there were still some higher level players still active. Now I wish I could revert some. I may dismiss a couple to get the rating back down idk?

    Congrats on that counter tactic, I was waiting for you to figure that out lol. Name's fine, but it's only against an old warband. If you ever want to try against my main for fun (you'll get +10 underdog bonus) put in the Passcode: party
  13. Cyberaddict Major

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    Maybe another tomorrow. I have to go... See you. That was super fun. Thanks! :)
  14. Cyberaddict Major

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    Anyone can answer that question about Infiltration? Will it hurt my rating a lot?
  15. Cyberaddict Major

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    Tested Infiltration on my Assassin. Rating went from 650 to 652. So that extra turn won't hurt my rating, while improving my odds against flyers in certain missions (looking at you, Shangular ; did your solo Mage-Captain recruited Elves?).
  16. Shangular Brigadier

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    I know the 3 elves format works great at high levels, my Middenheimers have won easily ever since (hence I voted them as best warband in other thread), albeit a low volume sample as PVP isn't as active. So decided to try to test it out at low level PVP. I was thinking of whether I should start a new warband to do so but was too lazy so decided to tack on this one.

    These guys are new so they still suck and miss a lot. But trust me, at high levels armed with sniper rifles, an 8 crit damage is not uncommon.
  17. Cyberaddict Major

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    I trust you. :) BTW, I hated this particular map, when you fly in and out with the treasure on turn 2. :( It forces me to chase you (the map isn't configured for interception, just a chase) and be very badly positioned for your counterattack. Which wasn't even necessary, you were in walking distance from the exit.

    Four of my Rats now have Infiltration, and I'm on my way of having the skill on all units. Won't be caught in that situation again with this Warband. :p
  18. Shangular Brigadier

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    I'm walking to the exit but I never plan on just escaping, where's the fun in that? My general tactic in treasure hunts is to grab the chest and then fly back and force opponents to fight me on my terms, like what you did there. I'm not going to be chasing after opponents once I have the chest.

    Creating that killzone is part of the tactic and it's been wonderous with my Middenheimers (elves hidden in Ambush and comet maul warriors ready to charge)

    If an opponent simply stays back or runs away, I'll get bored and then just end the match by moving to my zone and winning.
  19. Perl Fisher Private

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    Nah, ratingwise dual warplocks are not so bad. I have a full 8 member Skaven warband with a rating of just around 300 (as in 3 x hundred). They have ~20 levels each, avg. ranged skill of 3/6, all wield dual warplock pistols and wear heavy banded armour (except the sorcerer and wizard/assassin leader). The also all have infiltration and sprint.

    The rating system is broken, when it comes to dual pistols, and especially the Skaven ones having -50 enemy defence instead of just -15.

    Warplocks kick a$$, and needs to be nerfed IMHO. I think the designers intended the high gold cost and rarity to mitigate their awesomeness, but it doesn’t quite do it. I have three extra pairs of warplocks saved up in case of casualties.
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