Top of the Leaders table thread

Discussion in 'Bugs / Suggestions / Support' started by arielbelkin, Feb 22, 2018.

  1. Ewan Lamont
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    The second you reported it, Ariel, we started a really thorough investigation so much so it has delayed a major release for over a week. We agreed that the sudden leap looked weird, the offline play, Warband config, and the play style looked weird but we couldn't find an issue because there is no issue. MLF is run by a player who plays a lot...a hell of a lot. I can't suspend or ban a player who loves the game so much he spends just about every waking hour of the day playing it. I suspect his wife might like us to though.
  2. TheWizardWatley Major

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    I agree with Ariel.

    1 the issue should have been acted upon immediately it was reported, not left until it became a problem too big to fix. The jump in shard was too sudden and too large for you to have let it go. Suspension until resolution would have been a better approach.

    2 there's no point trying to compete now. Regardless of whether his actions are legit or not, he has now created an untenable position wherein no one can even get close to the top. Which brings up the question, exactly what's the point of the game now? For players like Ariel and I who had gotten high up in the tables, there is now no chance and definitely no reason to continue playing.

    3 I still find his arguments to be a little dodge. 50 games per day? Does he eat sleep or shit at all? It's totally farfetched to expect us to believe he hasn't found an exploit when he accumulates over 100 shard per day.

    4 if it his playing style only, then it follows that he is abusing the concept and nature of the game and making a mockery out of the rest of the dedicated and nonabusive players, and sadly yourselves, Legendary, as well. This in itself should be enough to force you to pull him up. As I have stated so many times times previously, many of the problems with games like this one is a tendency for players to want to break the system. In this particular case, MLF has done just this, and if I may say so, pissed off more than just me and Ariel off in the process (cf complaints re PvP play). As the overall adjudicators of the game, it is the responsibility of Legendary Games to ensure that players aren't abusing the base concept of Mordheim WS, and to enable ALL players the chance to enjoy the game.

    By letting this go on the way it has instead of taking immediate and decisive action, you have created a situation where one of the major metrics of success is now completely out of reach to normal players. On top of this, we players who have dedicated ourselves to the forums and beta testing and to contributing to the overall greatness of the game have been shafted in favour of a player who has contributed NOTHING, has never been on the forums, and has clearly little respect for the game or yourselves.

    I'm inclined to agree that Mordheim Warband Skirmish may be a dead end now. There certainly seems to be nothing in it for those who have tried to contribute or assist, certainly not even a mention in the credits, and certainly not even a little bit of a favourable ear when issues regarding what I can only describe as dodgy game play have occurred. There are more and more problems with play style being out of phase with the base game conceit, but I have stated that already.

    Your players suck, not the game, but until the players are fixed, I'm at a loss to see the point in continuing.

    Watley.
  3. TheWizardWatley Major

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    What is this "offline" play?
  4. Ewan Lamont
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    The action we should have taken was confirm he was legit immediately. We capture a lot of data from play, literally every action that a player makes, we know exactly how many games everyone has played and when. It is usually very easy to pick up when there has been a hack. It was a testament to the respect we shown to Ariels involvement and passion that we were very close to banning the top player on his say-so alone. MLFs playstyle isn’t an issue, everyone is entitled to do whatever “floats their boat” without hacking. There is a one-man Warband with a half-helm and long rifle lead by “Dredd” there is an all naked spear armed Warband called “this is Sparta”. This is all cool. If we find a distortion we will amend the game to fix it. My only concern with MLF was lower ranked warbands meeting him but he as a rating now that he will struggle with just one man in the band. The main reason he is at the top of the table is that he has played a lot of games, anybody with any playstyle would have a very hefty shard count win or lose if they play a lot of games. As regards whether he eats or sleeps maybe he can tell us. He does read the forums.
  5. Ewan Lamont
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    Playing without being connected to the internet. We take a snapshot of the database on every connection so you can play offline seamlessly if you are on a plain or train or don't want to use data on 4g though you won't be able to buy fate...or play pvp. When you next connect the device updates the server with all your activity.
  6. TheWizardWatley Major

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    Any comments on point 2?

    While I do understand the need to treat all players fairly, MLF has very much screwed it for anyone wanting to go for the top. Clearly, as has been pointed out repeatedly, fifty games a day is kind of unbelievable for the rest of us. Accumulating the way he has, and I can easily explain it quite easily (all warlocks and his leader have shard hunter), has effectively made a mockery your shard count leader table, and having changed his warbands name to MLF is also a bit of a "fuck you" to both me and Ariel and to yourselves.


    Isn't it obvious there is a gaping hole in the game if it can allow a play style like his to dominate a game based on skirmishing? It's an abuse of the underlying concept of the game, and rather disrespectful.

    Of course, you won't consider my comments. As usual. What will happen, again, is that you will pander to the cheat and the bad players in the spirit of correctness, and forget about those who actually paid, and continue to pay to enjoy your game. You need to draw a line in the sand as far as bad gamesmanship goes. If I'm out of line, so be it. But I can assure you, MLF is taking you guys for a ride and loving every minute of it.

    Watley

    PS if this fellow reads the forums, why won't he come out and defend himself?
  7. _Q_ Major

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    Don't reckon it's fair to have a go at Legendary for this, nor to continue to accuse MLF of cheating. They've investigated and found nothing illegitimate. MLF's play style is legit. If it weren't for the fact that he's racking up an insane shard count I doubt it would have raised many eyebrows. If he wants to play a stupid number of games each day, that's fine too - slating someone because they're more dedicated to playing than you isn't legit. Neither is "I put more into the community so my opinion should matter more".

    To me, the biggest issue here is that the only way to measure success is shard count. More leaderboards would give us more things to gun for - highest rating (subsets for warband type), most pvp wins, most pve wins, highest %age win rate (pvp and pve, or even both combined), most wins vs skaven, etc, etc...the list of possibilities is huge and should be a doddle to implement.

    However, there are a couple of things from the TT version that perhaps could be introduced to re-balance things; minimum warband size and a limit of only one hired sword of each type.
  8. Ewan Lamont
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    You play to have fun. Only one person can be in the top position the 100,000 other people will be looking at the table just to see their relative position. We have lots of ideas that we would like to do in the future, from weekly tournaments to campaign play but all changes will take a lot of work and time. We modeled all the warlocks having shard hunter and it makes a bit of a difference but not enough to be game breaking. The way to maximise shard return per game is to have a large Warband and play PvP. MLF has not bothered with any of that and gone with the volume of games. We are planning a small change to give low-level characters a better chance against high level but we would need to do that anyway with the vampire coming out. We always have and always will consider your comments, along with everyone else’s on this forum.
  9. TheWizardWatley Major

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    Because your players treat PvP with SUCH respect.... yeah right!!!

    If you been following all of this, you'd be aware of complaints brought up against MLF for disconns during PvP.

    I give up on you lot. Between "load spamming" and exploit users, not to mention this guys totally iffy idea of Mordheim, it has become obvious that the inherent nature of gaming has become one of using any unintentional hole in a system to utterly break it, and not in the spirit of gamesmanship but only to serve a petty self indulgence. From all the behaviour demonstrated by players and writers on the forum, I have seen the decent gamers yelled down by arguments as weak as "it doesn't say you can't", because that's a valid defence.

    For the last time, I will suggest that the almighty progs encourage decent and respectful play. Maybe you don't understand what that is. I've given you all the benefit of the doubt as far as intelligence goes.

    Enjoy the swill, Ewan, cos that all you have left here now.

    Watley
    Over and OUT.
  10. arielbelkin Major

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    It has been a month since all this started and MLF has gained nearly 6000 shards in that time span. Honestly, the whole situation stinks and I don’t buy any of the explanations of how this was done. BUT I have no control over the matter and it’s Legendary Games’ decision to approve of all this. To Legendary’s credit I was refunded all the money ($23) I spent during this on-going process.

    Unfortunately, I have no interest in the game if I cannot be competitive and while I understand this is my choice - AND I had a good 3.5 months of fun, worth the money I spent - it is a shame I walk away with a semi-sour taste in my mouth.

    Maybe if things change down the line I’ll pick it back up.
    TheWizardWatley likes this.
  11. TheWizardWatley Major

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    Two top players down for one exploiting cheat.
  12. nahar Private

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    Being top player in this game is pretty easy - more time you spend on game you will collect more shards. Nothing more. My best team has approx. 1500 shards and it is 48 or smth at the ladder. Yesterday I checked how long it takes one match playing 1-2 warriors against normal team (6 warriors). I dissmised whole band to drop rating from almost 500 to 200. One winning game took me about 8 min. So it's easy to count. MFL without any problems play 50 games per day if he has only one guy. He fights against bands with low rating (1600) so probably he spends about 10 min per game. If you want to beat him you have to lower your rating and spend the same amount time playing.

    Personally I dont care about ladder because it's stupid to measure who is better by counting how many shards he collects. It is only a matter od time spend on playing. And how much money invest in fates to secure your warrior.

    One should be change no more than one type of hired sword per band. This rule is crucial in TT Mordheim.
    Marquand likes this.
  13. Marquand Major

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    And that's the point. If someone is so butthurt about "not being first on the table" I think he should reconsider why he's playing at all.
    It's super silly to complain about such things unless you get money or your very life depends on being first ranker.
    Amaan Shawkath likes this.
  14. Shangular Major

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    I play this game for fun so don’t care much about rankings. But I have played another mobile game competitively in the past and legitimately achieved number one rank so I can understand the desire of some players to want to be realistically able to work towards that.

    My recommendation based on the other game I’ve played is that 1). PVP rankings are made separate from overall rankings. This only shards acquired in PVP count. 2). Have PVP seasons that reset rankings after 1 or 2 months. The top player gets a speciL prize like an exclusive recruit to hire to a piece of equipment that is unique. That way every season all players have a chance to again compete for number one rank.

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